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Post by nige_LS7 on Aug 4, 2015 15:09:19 GMT
Quite a few on here seem to have experienced or witnessed Bertie pulling a rod in the river, and so there's a lot of "always hold onto it" advice on the forum.
But I don't like holding it, and I just prefer to watch it like a hawk with the bait-runner on and a stable rod rest with all the rod and reel weight as low and as far on my side of the rest as possible. I've not yet had any fish that took me straight into snags before I could react. I reckon I've landed 8 barbel out of about 13 'contacts' this season, and of the 5 that I lost, 2 were hooks pulled off at the knot on first striking (could have been another large species I guess, but probably barbel), 2 hooks thrown near the net after 10-minute fights on the Wye, one of which was half-straightened, and 1 really mighty fish on the Wye that I gave too much freedom to snag me in thick streamer weed after it had been on fighting strongly for about 15 minutes.
I take fish welfare and lost hooks very seriously of course, but I was just naive at the start of this season in thinking that what would do for small carp would do for barbel - I now know better. Now that I'm using stronger hooks and braid, with different knotting technique, it might only have been that one biggest fish I would have failed to land, and maybe knowing what I know now I'd have bullied more and could probably have landed that one too.
I don't knowingly fish right next to any real snags, and I have happily assumed, so far, that a barbel hooked at the edge of a willow on the Nidd is far enough from the roots of that willow that I've got time to tighten up and put pressure on before it gets there. Then once I've hit, I'll hold. It's only then that the fish seems to look for the roots and snags, not in the actual "take and run" when my clutch is offering little or no resistance.
It seems to be working for me so far but am I being daft using baitrunner for Bertie?
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Post by gcb on Aug 4, 2015 19:44:41 GMT
Very interesting post nige ! There probably isn't a method that works all the time but here are my thoughts. Firstly I rarely use my baitrunner. I think it is for lazy anglers who like to doze off - have a walk down the bank or to the car. I fish short sessions - rarely more than 5 hrs and my eyes are on my rods at all times. The rods are such that they are within 2ft of my hands. I usually fish alone, by preference, I find I catch more if I don't chat or walk up and down the bank to chat to my fishing buddy. It means that hit and hold fishing tight to far bank willows is possible. I use 12lb mainline and 11.5 lb hooklength. I am an experienced barbel angler but have been caught unawares. About 3 yrs ago I was fishing under the weir from the island at topcliffe on prepared cheesy pellets. I caught 7 fish in a short time most of which merited a photo. I was just photographing my catch when the other rod went off - pulled straight into the weirpool. It is a sickening feeling when you see the rod but slide into the water. I ran over - only about 8 yds - not really knowing what to do. Amazingly the fish stopped his run when the rod butt was in about 18 inch of water so I dived in and retrieved the rod and the fish. The lesson is - if your guard is down for even 30 seconds or your tackle is inadequate you will be made to pay. You may go to bed that evening thinking you should do things different next time. The magnificent creature you were lucky enough to hook may be towing your tackle around the river until it comes to a premature end and drowns in the water that was it's home before you came along.
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Post by kpkh on Aug 4, 2015 20:09:08 GMT
Butt rests are the way foreword for barbel. I watch the rod all the time but like to know the rods safe if i get distracted. Wouldn't want to miss out on all the stuf you see when fishing just because I was scared to look away for a second! Plus I can get up for a leak without having to wind in ;-)
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Post by patterdalewilson on Aug 4, 2015 20:52:06 GMT
Good post Nige and some good replies , you have to do whatever you're comfortable with imo.
Personally I fish with baitrunners on but TIGHT in really secure banksticks so they give line but begrudgingly. I also like to fish two rods where possible so holding them is not a option.
I have only once had the rod pulled in and that was pre baitrunner days , I don't think many anglers fall for it more than once.
Touching wood . Mick
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Post by nige_LS7 on Aug 4, 2015 21:05:58 GMT
Good replies, thanks - and it's reassuring Mick that i'm not the only baitrunner user.
Kpkh I feel like I can have that same security with the bait-runner - as long as the clutch makes a bit of noise. I've not used bite alarm, but to me that clutch noise is like a bite alarm. It's never taken me even 2 seconds to strike, and the rod has never been pulled anywhere, not even by a powerful run, cos there's very little resistance.
I'd only move more than 2 or 3 feet away from the rod (ie for a leak etc) if I had reeled in, and if I ever nodded off I reckon I'd just go home.
I'm certainly not using it cos I'm lazy Geoff (though I know you weren't suggesting I was) ... more because I can be over-eager to strike, and would otherwise tend to strike too soon , and above all because by trial and error it's brought me relative success, with a fair few chub as well as barbel hooking themselves (I prefer a short hair with the bait pretty much touching the bottom of the hook)
I guess like you say Mick it's all about confidence coming from what we're each comfortable with. I suppose all I was hoping was that I wouldn't be given too many horror stories of baitrunner tactics leading to disaster, and so far there haven't been any...
Good Topcliffe story that Geoff. I've yet to fish that weirpool but it's high up on my list and you've whetted the appetite.
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Post by Eddie on Aug 4, 2015 21:47:51 GMT
Ha, just back from an evening session, fishing 2 rods, one with baitrunner on and the other rod fished tight to a fallen tree, baitrunner off. Any fish picking that bait up was going nowhere! The rod with the baitrunner on accounted for 3 barbel up to nearly 7lb, well one actually was in the landing net, and waiting to be weighed, when off goes the other rod, the fish managed to pull the rod out of the rear butt rest (cup type) and the rod was like a sea saw, but I'am getting good at catching it last second so no problem! anyway result a nice 9lb 2oz barbel and a very satisfied angler with 4 fish in a hectic short session.
Eddie.
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Post by rushy on Aug 4, 2015 21:57:34 GMT
One thing is for sure . . . If you have the rod in your hand or on your knee it is highly unlikely to get pulled in. I think bait runners are fine if used in the correct way . . Ie you are still within a foot or so of your rods and you are concentrating on them. I was talking to the baliff at Smeaton Lakes on the Trent last week and he was telling me 3 rods had been pulled in the previous week with lads leaving them on the bait runners at the bottom of the steps while they sat at the top of the steps waiting for the bite alarms to go off. That's 3 dead certain dead Barbel ! I believe bait runners were originally designed with the carp angler in mind. The difference being , the Carp lads point there rods at the lead and the pull is straight onto the reel and the bait runner action is smooth. When Barbel fishing the rod is either at an angle up in the air or to the side and the initial ver aggressive whack from a Barbel coupled with the angle of the rod can still lift the rod over its fulcrum point ( did you like that Mick ! ). The solution as Karl says is a butt grip or similar. I've invested in one since my last episode and whenever I have the rod at my side rather than on my knee it is in the butt grip. If you prefer the bait runner Nige , and a lot of anglers do, stick with it and as long as you stick to your routine of not being far from your rods I'm sure all will be fine. Wouldn't use a bait runner on the Nidd though  |
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Post by nige_LS7 on Aug 4, 2015 22:16:43 GMT
Ha, just back from an evening session, fishing 2 rods, one with baitrunner on and the other rod fished tight to a fallen tree, baitrunner off. Any fish picking that bait up was going nowhere! The rod with the baitrunner on accounted for 3 barbel up to nearly 7lb, well one actually was in the landing net, and waiting to be weighed, when off goes the other rod, the fish managed to pull the rod out of the rear butt rest (cup type) and the rod was like a sea saw, but I'am getting good at catching it last second so no problem! anyway result a nice river wharfe 9lb 2oz barbel and a very satisfied angler with 4 fish in a hectic short session.
Eddie.
Stunning fish and that photo looks like an oil painting! Sounds like a spectacular session that, Eddie, and i'm honoured to have it featured in"my" thread when it really deserves one of its own, but yes, you've answred the question there all right!!! |
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Post by johnboy66 on Aug 4, 2015 23:01:51 GMT
it all depends on the peg I`m fishing in and what`s in front of me, I use a bait runner but on the Nidd I have my rod on a back rest and the reel is tight with a little give. I`d rather have the fish take my line than my rod !!!
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Post by patterdalewilson on Aug 4, 2015 23:39:26 GMT
The secret is rock solid banksticks , if the rods need pointing skywards the rear bankstick needs to have a tube style fitting with the front one deep enough to retain the rod . If you like your rod low or pointing directly at the end tackle a tightfitting rear grip does the job.
Of course fishing tight to snags calls for a different approach. We all need to fish responsibly but I have yet to catch a barbel still attached to someone elses rod or find a dead one in the same predicament.
Tight lines
Mick
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Post by mortia on Aug 5, 2015 6:59:25 GMT
Sometimes when I am fishing with a chair I attach a piece of velcro strap to the chair & loosely wrap it around the rod butt ( it detaches easily when you pull in to a fish)to give that extra bit of security when the head starts to nod !! Not so straight forward when sitting on an unhooking mat though ! This year I have experimented with slackening my clutch a little ( I normally fish with it tight)to give added security that my rod won't get pulled in - but I'm not so comfortable with this method as some of the places I fish I don't want to give the fish too much head to get on a downstream charge.
Cheers
Andy
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Post by chubber on Aug 5, 2015 7:33:55 GMT
So, I guess touch legering is no longer in fashion  |
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Post by rushy on Aug 5, 2015 13:28:35 GMT
Horses for courses !!! On the narrow rivers nid or dearne or suchlike I wouldn't use the bait runner but anywhere that allows I would simply because it's safer in my opinion especially if two rods are being used . I would ask anyone who has lost a rod to a barbel to think carefully about what you can do in the future to prevent it happening again because it's got to be the worst way to go if you are a fish towing an Avon quiver about till exhaustion finally kills it . For me there's no better sound than line being stripped from the reel by a big barbel which is an added bonus ,,,,,, You've obviously not heard the sound of Cabbos wallet opening then Chris to buy a round ........................... no , me neither  |
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quint
Junior Member
Posts: 99
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Post by quint on Aug 5, 2015 14:35:13 GMT
Using Baitrunners should have no impact on fish safety if used correctly, and having sturdy rod support is a must.
If lads are getting their rods pulled in with baitrunners on then it is extremely poor angling.
If I'm fishing close to snags then I tend to leave them off and make sure the rods are rock solid and going nowhere on the banksticks/tripod, I'll also use an alarm to give me a few bleeps as the line tightens if I'm looking away.
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quint
Junior Member
Posts: 99
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Post by quint on Aug 5, 2015 20:38:34 GMT
I use delkim's mate, you won't hear them in the next peg when I use them, I have them dead quiet and you can adjust them to be exactly how sensitive you want them, and it means I don't have to stare at the rod top for hours on end.
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