Sandwath Survey

[rickyg]

that is a staggering amount of fish,if stocking was the answer it should be the best silverfish/tench water in yorkshire.Alot of the fish stocked seem never to have been seen, never mind caught, is there a black hole in sandwath ?The only fish to have limited success are the larger bream and tench,if any further stockings take placeI would plump for these rather expensive fish

[stumpy]

it may be time to think about controlling the pike levels

[gcb]

There would be more larger pike or a few monsters caught if the pike were responsible for the disappearance of the stocked fish stumpy.

[stumpy]

gcb if you dont think pike are the problem whats your theory

[kpkh]

i agree with gcb that thers far too much stock on that list to dissapear down the pikes throats but were have they gone? used to fish a pond in selby which was stuffed with skimmers of all sizes! yet ther was a spell of around 4/5 years where nobody caught any. then as quick as they stopped being caught, people started catching them again! there are no rules to sugest that fish should feed on what anglers want to catch them on, maybe they are feeding on something else or at night when thers less chance of being eaten. doesnt explain why they didnt turn up in the nets though!

[knowbody]

Nov 23, 2010 0:47:07 GMT frim said:

Catches, condition and the average size of fish in polo would improve by the cropping of small fish, though I am not sure that Sandwath would benefit from another glut of tiny silvers.
Unlike Polo Sandwath has never seemed able to sustain the stocks given to it, and only the larger Irish bream stocked in the mid 90s gave anything longterm.
I've spent hours with Dave and Graham trolling through the old stocking program's and its becoming obvious that most times less is best.
I think the survey results have opened up a few anglers eyes and the figures I will show now will open them a bit more.
SANDWATH STOCKING "all certified"
1992 250lb ROACH
100X 1LB BREAM
100X 6-8" BREAM

1993 1100X 6"BREAM
1994 1200X CRUCIANS
300 X CHUB
100 X 7" BARBEL

1995 813 X 1LB BREAM
375LBX LARGE BREAM
210LBX 2LB TENCH
100X 8" TENCH

1996 500LB MIXED ROACH BREAM

1997 1000X 6" ROACH

1998 1000X 12OZ BREAM

1999 200LB MIXED COARSE FISH

FOOT AND MOUTH

2002 200LB MIXED COARSE FISH

2004 600LB MIXED COARSE FISH

2005 200X1LB TROUT
200LB BREAM TENCH

2007 250LB BREAM ROACH TENCH

2008 1200X 6"8" CARP

2009 50X 3LB CARP

Its accepted that Pike ratios should be about 30lb of Pike to 300lb of available prey fish.
Whats your thoughts?
Steve

WOW!!!!! I think this explains why you have a pike problem, and lots of silvers. To me it seem's like you have been encorageing them! (you sure your not in the PAC Frim?)

Stop stocking, stop anglers overfeeding the carp and wait. (I did'nt realise you put so many carp in, they just compeat with the bream and tench in the long run and win 99.9% of the time, they eat a lot of natural spawn from all fish too. I recon the carp are prolonging the agony.) The pike will find a balence and go away, if left to there own devices, the problem you have is anglers that kill them thinking they are doing good. Every time someone kills a 4lb jack you in reality make room for 8' 8oz jacks, witch now thanks to carp and the anglers that feed them have so much small silver fish to feed on make it a dead cert for more and more jacks to survive, if some "angler" were lucky enough to catch that 22, then think he was doing a good thing by killing it...........what a mess waiting to happen!

Dare I say it, (hell yes) but you will have an easyer time removeing the carp so the tench and bream can florish again.

Carp don't spawn as readilly as pike so would be easyer to get rid off.

[knowbody]

Nov 23, 2010 14:04:07 GMT stumpy said:

it may be time to think about controlling the pike levels

Can you tell us how to do that? Killing them makes it all wrong for longer. The only controle is themselves.

I'll say it again, you will not win unless you poison the whole lake and start again!

No trout water in the uk has come close, I doubt you guys will eather. Most trout waters now have winter pike fishing...........

It's the carp that need controling! (elephant in the room :

[bizz]

Have you got your ponds mixed up knowbody i cant see one carp exept that koi in fernleys photographs so whats to get rid of, i did see loads of fish in kippax polo pond with no pike, but loads of pike in sandwath but nowt much else, the megga stocking is the reason that sandwath has produced pike to over thirty pound, the explosion of small pike is now down to lack of foodfish avalable to make them grow, if you leave them alone you will just get more but thinner small pike. trout lakes have big pike and not many jacks because they grow by eating trout its called balance. sandwaths got neither

[knowbody]

Bizz, you may be right, but Frim did say the netsmen did lose a carp estamated at 14lb, now considering the first carp stocked were only 2 years ago and at best 3lb in weight? Thats a hell of a growth rate, even for a well fead carp. It would be nice to know what "mixed" corse fish are made up of? Or is Frim fibbing?

If the pike were allways the problem why did the club keep feeding them? How many pike have been removed over the years?

Trout lakes have big pike because they have an unbalenced biomass of prey items (stocked trout) this is unbalenced not balenced, hence the large number of oversized pike. Stop putting trout in and the pike numbers go down, big ones and small ones.

What would be nice is a balenced angler!!!

As for Sandwath just ending up with lots of smaller and thinner pike, we will never know unless they get left alone, by that I mean the bankside fishery management crew from the past that still think the only good pike is a dead pike have to stop killing them too.

Balence is a thing that nature needs no help with, if every pond should be brimming with fish then sell off all the club waters and leases and dig a big hole and fill it with what you like to catch........a bit like woodlands did. But you will need bums on seats to feed them, they only work because anglers are willing to by there food. A pond full of starving carp and minnows is all that would be left without anglers throwing food at them long term, sad but true.

It would seem more fish go in and out of this place than just the club stockings?

[frim]

Mr k, Your at it again ;D assuming and presuming what I am responsible for, only for the past 3/4 years have I been in a position to be included in decision making.
Most of the old guard are dead mate "move on"
One thing I will take credit for though, is in those few years I have insisted on getting rid of the old secret service, opening up information to members, and bringing a few new ideas and professionalism to some committees that didn't like it.
Opinions are just opinions, but you cant be pulled up for telling the truth.
The stocking table was copied from old bits of paper exactly as they were wrote down, I don't fib and would have expected someone of your intelligence to see that I did of give sizes and species when the information was available "Crucians, trout, barbel, chub, tench, big bream, and the dreaded carp, for everyones information I have since found out that the mixed coarse fish all came from our stock ponds at Temple Newsham and consisted of mainly roach skimmers perch gudgeon and tench.
You assume and suggest that anyone in fisheries management or anglers in general that don't fit in with you, want to kill the 22 pounder or knock all pike on the head "they don't mate"
Your hate and blame the carp for everything attitude is just as misguided as those that think pike will eat themselves out of house and home.
The big females in Sandwath are a must for the fishery, but the extra large numbers of Jacks are not, the balance is all wrong and we don't have 10 years on the half chance it will put its self right, maybe a drain down and start again is the answer.
(only an opinion)
Steve

[stumpy]

Well said Frim

[endpegger]

i would drain it take out all the obviously stunted little fish put a load of carp in thats what people like to fish for nowadays ,it seems to me that mr no just likes to sit at home posting on fishing sites trying to make himself look clever and winding people up .i would suggest getting a life buying some fishing tackle and parking his arse on a fishing box rather than a couch. ;D ;D ;D

[gcb]

It is a pity that your plan is as unimaginative as to create yet another carp lake endpegger. I for one fish at least twice a week but I like a challenge- catching pastie sized carp doesn't float my boat. Years back I used to enjoy getting up early and fishing for the specimen sized tench that could be had on sweetcorn in the margins at sandwath. I am happy that we have members like frim who care as much about the state of the fishery as the fishing. I don't think knowbody is having a go at you frim. From what I have read he seems to respect your efforts for the club and is as keen as you are to have a healthy fishery.
geoff

[jerseyman]

Ah, nice to see a well balanced debate, Mr K ,go get a box , Frim ,do your self a favour and go enjoy somefishing, while you still can. life's too short as it is.

[stanfish]

hi guys, i have read with interest your views,you have seen the ammount of fish put into sandwath,what we have not seen is what has left through the gates in a van,i will not bore you with the story but a new lock up gate is now on the lake,if you go there plase take your year book show anyone there your book and ask to see theres(balifs warant is on the back page)if you think anyone on any of our venues is up to no good ring the police and report it to the wildlife unit,we are still wating for the report from the pros who netted the lake,when we recive it we will act on thier advice for the good of all our members,by the way we went a few times this summer and there was never more than 1 person fishing in july?i did have some good catches of bream though and my son in law andy butty had a tinker 9lbs 8oz great fish,but why is no one there? stan..